I'd try and be a devils advocate and play the side of pro-religion, but I find I'm not very good at it. So instead I'd like to know how you lost your faith in a religion if you've lost it, and if you haven't, why you believe.

None of the ones (that I was born in and investigated) could answer my questions. In fact they raised too many of their own. And there were too many ilogical aspects to em.

Final stage was when I realised that they ALL were man-made.... could not abide that

I haven't lost my faith, but it has been weakened over the last 6 years in a process that sounds quite similar to dekrazee's.  The church I belong to answers all the questions I have about God, our existence, and other of the most common big questions quite satisfactorily in my view.  However, there are a number of things I have not found answers to yet, mostly regarding the church's history.  I'm at the point now where I feel like either the church I belong to now (and have my whole life) is the only completely true one (others having some degree of truth in them), or they are all man-made, as dekrazee now believes.

I have a question, though, dekrazee:  You now believe that when people die, their bodies waste away and that person is gone forever, correct?  (I'm assuming.)  Does that scare you at all?  Personally, I'm terrified of the thought of not existing.  Oh, I know that if I don't exist I won't be able to feel anyway, so it won't matter, but I am honestly very scared of it.  Sometimes it keeps me up at night, trying to imagine what it would be like to slip from consciousness into non-existence.  Of course I can't.   But still, I wonder how it would be, and whether the energy that once existed as "me" would ever take a form so as to make "me" exist again -- such as a spirit, reincarnation, or even simply uninhabitable consciousness floating through the cosmos.  Thoughts, anyone?

The thought of non-existence scares me shitless, but someone who lived 2000+ years ago saying I will live forever in some strange spiritual way doesn't re-assure me.

Besides, you body is actually a fairly large part of the experience of existence - your brain has no other way of knowing about the world, and I don't see how a mind can possibly be separated from its brain (mind being tied to brain is actually a more direct link between "dead" and "gone" but I didn't think of that first)

So basically, my only hope is for medical advances in extending lifespan to improve faster than I age (if they find a way to extend my lifespan by 20 years, they'd better find a way to extend it some more within those 20 years) It seems kind of a lost cause, but it could be done - there's one scientist-y guy I heard about once who thinks it can be done, and that the first person to live past 1000 will be about 45 today (even if he's 30 years out then I'm in with a chance) 

I have a question, though, dekrazee:  You now believe that when people
die, their bodies waste away and that person is gone forever, correct? 
(I'm assuming.)

Yup. Correct assumption. It was scary/depressing when I realised it, but I'm at a stage now where it doesn't bother me. It in fact spurs me on to to the best with my life. I don't believe there is such a thing as immortality. The most you can do is leave your mark on the world in a sense. Say you write a classic novel which will be read in ages to come. it is a form of being remembered. but it means nothing to me because a reader 100 years from now will know nothing abt me. Just the words that I wrote. Of which they'll be making their own meaning anyway. And that's a false sense of comfort in my opinion. 

So yeah, my opinion is I was born, I'll live and I'll die. Could die tomorrow or 80 years from now. Doesn't make a difference since if I'm dead, it won't make any difference anyways 

Wow I believe we are transported over the River Styxx and we haev to haev coins on our eyes for the boatman

why can't I type have right lol

I told ya I could prove the existence of God DEZ lol ,  you did not want to believe in the possibility of the possible lmao

If/When I die, I'm hoping for Valhalla!

I was a Viking too long long ago King

Yo Phantom, prove it first and then we'll talk abt me believing

Hehehe!!! Valhalla would be a great ship to get on!!!

Oh, and I don't see it as 'losing faith'.... more like 'redirected faith'

Getting back to the orignal topic (one of the reasons why tangler really frustrates me... but I digress), I was raised in a very strict catholic household. I went to catholic high school. In year 8 the ex nun religion teacher told us that we literally had to believe that the bread was the body of christ and the wine the blood of christ. When I asked, "so what happens if you don't belive" she said "Well you are not a catholic then", so I said, "So I'm not a catholic then" and that was that. So I don't beleive it is loosing of faith it was choosing that I don't want to be a part of this faith that I was forced into as a kid. From that age (about 13) till when I left home at 19 I had regular very heated arguments just about every sunday when the parents would FORCE me to go to church. It was really horrible. They even started a youth group hoping that would entice me... it was full of druggies and alco's and I could not see beyond their complete hypocrisy of going out getting pissed and stoned then coming to catholic youth group. 

I lost my faith when I realized that my church doctrine was passing judgement on my personal life choices.  I examined what I thought a 'loving' God would think of these choices, and whether or not He would have any problem with the decisions that I had come to in my personal life.  Mind you, these were actions that hurt no one, but that church doctrine taught as unacceptable for spiritual reasons.  After realizing that I was being controlled by my religion, rather than being uplifted by it, I decided that this wasn't for me.  I wonder if I ever had any faith that God was there.  In some respects, I still have a fear of God.  For example, I refuse to participate in the YouTube 'Deny God' experiment.  After all, how can you deny something does not exist? 

Perhaps I have not lost faith in His existence, but only in man's ability to express His will.

I lost mine in the back seat of my old Chrysler Galant.

LOL.... you're a nut Ruski....

Jodiem and rgautier - this might be semantics and I've brought it up before - is it really a matter of 'losing' faith or just redirected faith? I find that I don't like saying I lost my faith cos it implies (esp from a religious point of view) that I'm lost or defective in some sense, when all I've done is choose not to follow the stuff shoved into my head 

But how can you lose something you never found.  I don't think that I've ever found a belief in 'God'.  I don't have any reason to believe that a supernatural being exists other than fourth-hand accounts from people with stature to gain.  So, while I'm unwilling to deny that there is a God, barring absolute evidence to that fact, I'm also unwilling to deny that there is in fact a Tooth Fairy, whether or not my parents pretended to be him or her for 7 years.  While I'm not afraid of said fairy, I do have a healthy fear of God because I have been told that he is fearsome, and should he exist, I'd rather he not be completely pissed off when I get to the Happy Hunting Grounds.

While I'm not afraid of said fairy, I do have a healthy fear of God
because I have been told that he is fearsome, and should he exist, I'd
rather he not be completely pissed off when I get to the Happy Hunting
Grounds.

Why would you believe that when at best it's hearsay?

Why would you believe that when at best it's hearsay?

So you say.

I have been told that he is fearsome

Yes, I say, because not all 'gods' are spoken of that way 

I'm referring to the idea that he's fearsome as hearsay in this case, not that god is at best hearsay (for this discussion)

Sorry $deezee$, I misunderconstood you.

No worries!

I'll save the other hearsay for another discussion 

I'll bet you will!!

If 100 people told you that just around the corner was a giant Tyrannosaurus Rex, and they were all cowering in fear in the hallway, would you turn the corner or just wait it out?

That's why I would believe it.  It's not worth getting eaten just to show that I am 99% certain that T-Rex's have been extinct for a few million years.

So, will I deny God and have an infinitesimally small chance of him ZOTting me, or just say, Yeah - ok, I think you're all nuts, but I'm not going to deny him just to prove that I'm braver than you.

Let the fat kid do it...we'll all watch and see what happens to him at The Day of Reckoning, should there be one.

To that same end, I believe that I can justify myself to a loving God, should the need arise, by living my life according to a moral code, and that moral code being based upon the principles of Christianity (love for one another).

I also know that I am not perfect, and if He does decide to ZOT me for not having blind faith in him, then I assume that is His perogative and there's nothing I can do about it, short of doing something against the concept of faith in my own intellect. 

To many Christians, I think this final concept of faith in your self is what you must give up to have true faith.  You must give up your trust in your own thought process.  I am unwilling to do so.

So in other words, it's insurance?

If I was God, the first part of my Judgement Day would be to send all the blindly faithful zealots, anyone who was militant in my name or anyone who used me as an excuse to be a prick straight to the lowest nether-hell

Then those who had considered things carefully, picked a world view (be it me, science, some other religion, whatever) and stuck with it without being all in-you-face about it get to come to the VIP section of heaven, followed shortly by all those people who were basically good people

People who were arrogant twats go to a marginally higher nether-hell than the zealots

Then its party time in heaven  

Bill Gates died, and upon meeting St. Peter, asked him "So I'll get into heaven no problems, right?"  St. Peter said that it was up to Bill to choose, and he could go to both heaven and hell for a few days and then decide which one he preferred.  So, Bill goes to hell and finds it's nothing like he imagined.  There's non-stop parties, free booze, drugs, fast food and heaps of good-looking women.  Since you're already dead, you can drink as much as you want.  Bill is having great time in hell.  Next he tries heaven, and it's soooo boring, with all that harp music, and an ambience like a library.  After a few days of this, he can not dream of spending eternity in heaven.  Decision day arrives, and Bill meets St. Peter.  St. Peter asks him,  "So, Bill, you've seen both heaven and hell, which do you prefer?"  Remember once you decide, you can't come back.  It's for all eternity."  Bill says "I really enjoyed hell.  Heaven was really boring, like going to my nanna's house.  I think I'll go to hell.  "You sure?"  "Yes, Bill replies.  I'm sure".  St. Peter snaps his fingers and Bill is transported to hell.  But instead of the non-stop party he had last time, he's in a hot cauldron of oil, sulphourus fumes fill his lungs, and a devil with a pitchfork is poking him in the ass.  Bill screams: "What's this?  Last time I was here on a temporary basis there was a non-stop party!"  The Devil chuckles. "That was the Beta version.  This is the full release."

hahahahaha

Somehow I can't picture Bill partying his socks off 

That was funny though.