When a friend or relative is visiting your house with their kids... are you allowed to tell the kids what to do???  Or should you have to reply on their parents to stop them???

e.g. no shoes inside..... no food in the lounge room....  no touching my home theatre system... no throwing anything!!

....
....
....
and what about the parents??? can you  say .. "Please don't give chocolate cake to your 2 year old and let them wander through the house"

I really don't want to piss anyone off... But I think I have the right to stop my stuff from getting trashed.....

I think you can say it....

Nothing wrong with saying 'don't do that' or 'sit down and drink so that you don't spill anything' etc

I have rope on hand for such a situation, and do not hesitate to use it.

You can say it, the kids don't really mind.

Just smile and be friendly. 

The kids are cool, I get on really well with kids (well I still am one myself)... I also kinda look a liitle scary which helps out a bit

It's just the parents I worry about... I just don't want them to say after leaving - .... F***ing Mitch!!.... how dare he  tell my kid what to do...

Yeah, that's the core of it....

Kids are cool.... parents ruin it all 

*runs and hides*

Yeah, you're right.  If you ask the kids if they want to spend 3 boring hours at the mall going to Woolies and Coles on Saturday in a pram the size of a Hummer they'll say no.  It's the parents who drag them along for the rest of us heartless, childless folks to deal with.  After I press send, I'm crawling under my desk.....

HAHAHAHAHA

One by one, we're all going into hiding  

Pushed into exile

It's almost as bad as doubting the new religion of climate change.

and the old one

My new avatar.

hahahaahah

Good pic 

Don't get me started on shops... kids.. prams... mothers... squealing....grrrrrr!!!!

I want to get a t-shirt made that says - "You're kid is fugly" and wear it to the local Westfield.

I have a lot more anti-brat t-shirt ideas...

"Your child is not a genius"

Your child is not special

"I hate your baby"

..
now who needs to hide??

My favourite is: My German Shepherd is Smarter than your Honour Student!

RIP Ramones. Geez that pissed me off when Ramones T-shirts got popular a year or so ago....fuckers......

we need to start a new group for this.... our membership is slowly (but surely) increasing

called "Soccer Moms"

maybe the 'anti-parents brigade'?

Let's be fair and direct our angst at the correct targets 

We'll need to make it a private group or we'll get death threats.....

hahahaha yeah!!

But we are a dying breed.... we have to get together - power in numbers or something like that 

I saw a bumber sticker in Oregon that said "Thank you for not breeding"-The council for zero population growth.

yeah but you rubbish the children to piss off the parents... They use their kids for all manner of excuses.... so we now turn their weapons against them!! MUHAHAHAAAA!!

hahahahaah

Are you at any stange planning to be a parent?

I ask cos karma bites 

If we have a private group, I can share what I said to a teenage mum when she called me a litter bug for putting out a ciggy in the gutter (when I used to smoked)

I think so... Doesn't mean my kids will be little brats though....

If I ever become a parent, I will have no trouble admiting that my kid is Ugly, dumb, unco etc...

I'm too old.  I have bratty cats.

Mitch - everyone says that.... and then the kid is born and all that baby powder gets into your brain and alters your mind

true - except I have a lot of nieces & nephews...

and they are little shits and I tell them so.

I like kids... as long as they behave.....  which isn't their fault... it's their parents..

I have no plans to have kids.... just won't rule it out.

hehehe okay okay

Back to bashing parents then

yeah through their kids.... here's another t-shirt idea.. front & back..

"Your child does not have ADD"

"You are just a bad Mother"

how about

"Did You know their Father?"

time to change my avatar and ID

Goodness....

You've spent some time thinking of these haven't ya? 

about 5 mins

Have I got news for you lot.

• Kids are noisy. They are still learning 'social skills'. Don't forget it is their zest, enthusiasm and occasional innocence which we cynical old bas - - rds most admire.
• Kids are tomorrow's grown-ups. You too were annoying, loud and invasive once upon a time.
• It will be my kids who will be wiping your asses when you can no longer do it yourself.
• It will be my kids finding the cure for cancer, diabetes etc...
• Erik - you didn't duck low enough. My kids and I have just catapulted a great deal of play dough, paint and last night's leftovers in your general direction. We hope it will hit some others along the way.
• Parents are human and have a sense of humour. This is part serious and part jest.
• And you all thought just cos' I was on holiday you could get away with a POST LIKE THIS. 
• Now it's my turn to duck.

Finally.... I was wondering where all the parents had run away to

ok these are not directed at anyone...
I have been poisoned by the loal
westfield..
Kasta, I am not directing these at you or anyone else..
this is not a personal attack..

discalimer disclaimer disclaimer..!!!!

how about these ones:

• All of the things your kids are -  is what you have taught them.

• You are responsible for everything your child does.
  

• a pram does not give you right of way.
• Your child is not special, cute, smart, different  to anyone else except you. 

• You don't want to hear about my bowel movements... I do not want to hear about your childs.

• Childbirth has been going on for thousands of years. It does not make you special or clever. 

• Control your kids in public places, otherwise do not be offended if you are asked to leave.

Cool!  Fight it out!  It all generates page views! And, greetings from beautiful Vancouver BC.  It's still really bright outside at 1900 local.

HAHAHAHAHA

No sitting on the fence Erik! 

I agree with all that MItch has said except the second one.

in this era with all the influences that are raound - parents don't have full control. Once a kid starts school - it's utter chaos. the Things they learn is beyond parents!!!

I was under the impression we were discussing below-primary-sch-age kids here

otherwise, I agree with you, they get influenced, but it's not an excuse 

below primary age kids go to school as well - daycare and nursery

A parent chooses when, where and what to do with their child... no one else.... daycare, nursery, primary school... thse are all choices a parent makes...

as well as TV, movies, computer games, books,  etc etc etc...

But you can't choose which kids also get into the school, and which your kids play with and picks things up from....

agree abt the TV, books etc etc tho 

Like this whole issue abt bratz dolls (whose existence I've just discovered)

If you're worried that they're too sexualised, DON'T BUY EM FOR YOUR KIDS!

Geez...... how hard is that?! 

but you can control how they deal with the things they pick up.....

at the end of the day, a parent is still responsible for everything a child does.. if they pick up bad behavoiur from another child, then they need to explain why it is wrong or bad...

ya - you gotta point there.

If johnny jumped off a bridge would you do it??

Man I got sick of hearing that....

hahahaha Same!

I always answered yes..

Childbirth has been going on for thousands of years. It does not make you special or clever.
Wanna bet? I guess it's one of those things you will never know... I found it hard not to feel that the whole thing was rather extraordinary.

Who are these parents that don't agree with what you have said, don't try hard to do the best job they can, think they live in a bubble (devoid of social responsibility) just because they have kids?? I am baffled at the judgements, rages and generalisations shown here. 

I don't expect the world to tolerate my children.  How outrageous that you expect me to expect that! Take me back to Europe where they let kids be kids and actually seem them as an asset.  And there is no God-type complex there in regards to children or parents. They just "are" and they just "do".

Oops. It's gone silent or someone is typing a long reply.

BTW - Have I told you I am toilet training my youngest? I thought I could use Tangler as a diary for our trials and tribulations and you could all comment along the way. JUST KIDDING. 'Scuse the pun. I am trying to make a joke and lighten the atmos-fear.

Hard for me to get on my soap box tonight.  Just had a lovely curry at a Pakistani place in Vancouver's West end, and washed it down with a nice local wheat beer.  Since I've been up since 0400, it's time to say good night, y'all.

Sounds lovely.

I'm just going to fly the white flag.

 Wanna bet? I guess it's one of those things you will never know... I found it hard not to feel that the whole thing was rather extraordinary.

That's fine... just don't expect anyone else to think you have done anything super-human...
How has having a child made a mother any more special than any of the millions of mothers throughout history? 

like I said... it might be special to you... just don't expect me to think so too...

why is it when you say don't take it personaly someone always does? 

I am baffled at the judgements, rages and generalisations shown here

Seriously baffled?? you can't see where any of this has come from?? completely blindsided??? would never think this could occur???

never had to put up with a 3 year old squealing it's head off at the table next to you in a restraunt?

never been rammed with a pram?

Never had a child cry/scream/talk all the way through a movie?

Like I said.. It's the parent who thinks that their children are amazing......and that you should think so too... so you should put up with them squealing/crying/running around/tantrums and all the rest.....

we don't have to.... 

and we are sick of it.

Mitch - I don't think I am special for having a baby or more special than anyone else who has had a baby. I was talking about the whole thing. The creation of a new life makes conception/childbirth/a living thing at the end of it, special. When I had a baby I marvelled at all the other women I saw (soon after)- those who have done it, those who have tried, those who may choose not to. I marvelled because we are able to have babies. And I marvelled at the baby I had.

Of course I have cringed when a baby/child has cried, at how some children and their parents behave. I am not a perfect mother and my kids are not perfect. Who is though? I am not really sure what point you are trying to make or what point you think I am trying to make. Of course I have been rammed with a pram. But I have been trodden on, run over by bikes, all sorts of annoying things - and they have been done by all sorts of people, kids, teens, adults, pensioners...

Sometimes I felt that your views were very one-sided and as a parent they did make me feel like I had to defend myself. So I did. It was not meant to offend but I also could not not reply.

OMG - This doesn't get any easier to read the day after. Truce Mitch? Maybe I should have employed the use of more emoticons throughout. I probably took the posts too seriously but I have to tell ya' sometimes I feel like as a parent I end up being some kind of enemy who has to apologise because I have had children.

Oh, and BTW. I think it's totally reasonable to ask a child to stop doing something if it's dangerous or destructive. I have done this with other children when the parents are around and when they are not around. It is reasonable to expect them not to ruin and mess up your home and a reasonable parent should not mind if their child is reprimanded.

I have a clear memory with one of my kids of putting my hand firmly over her mouth and very slowly explaining her options to her. She decided against further noise, which turned out to be the correct decision.

I also remember walking out of the room when one of the kids was lying on the kitchen floor screaming.  That caused the temper tantrum to run out of steam.  You can't do that when you're in public, though, which is why you also need option one.

If your kids are young enough that they're still running on instinct -- crying when they're hungry or tired or bored or it's Tuesday -- there are places you simply can't take them.

The one advantage I think I do have as a parent is that when the kids were young I developed a really good filter so that I could only hear my own kids cry.  I think all parents do this to a greater or lesser extent.  Even today, when my youngest is 19, I still automatically tune out babies crying.

I've learned that one too. I also tune out with mine sometimes. It's a basic survival strategy.

I find the experience of dealing with small children very useful in the workplace (insert emoticon of choice)

I think spending time with kids (who are not my own) can be less stressful than with adults

Please arrive by seven - I'm going to see Dylan Moran and the babysitter I booked is making unreasonable demands about money.

I have only one demand..... you stay in, the kids and I go to see Dylan 

Meanwhile - He's still here?!?!?!

Any chance his show isn't sold out? 

No chance - but there  are still tickets for Ed Byrne tomorrow night.  Too bad you can't go.

I only wanted to see Moran and Bhoy 

Damn those babysitters. They know they have you over a barrell and seem to be quite happy to use thier power to their advantage.

I've baby sat a few times.... has been the opposite in my experience!<div>:O</div>

I am currently "Childless by Choice" but love kids... with some exceptions...

Re: telling kids to behave when in your home... I have run into this issue with my nephew, who is prone to throwing fits to get his way (or get his older brother into trouble) and the way I handled it was very simple... I told him to either quit with the fit or remove himself to a room upstairs that has a clear floor and plenty of room for the rolling around and kicking of the legs.. plus it is far enough away from the sitting area so that he would not be heard.   

"This is my house, and at my house there are rules.  Rule number one is that you can't be rude.  Throwing a fit like a baby is rude, and you are welcome to continue your fit upstairs, but the rest of us do not have to allow you to ruin our visit with your behavior."

Five minutes later he was back amoung the rest of the family, eating a cookie and looking like an angel... and not throwing a fit.  Amazing what fresh cookies will do for the attitude of a 5 year old...

Its easier when the kids' parents aren't around don't you think?

I feel bad disciplining a child whose parent is there.... not sure how they'd react to it.

Some give me the go ahead, which is great.... some just sit there and pretend nothing is happening.... that I don't appreciate 

I agree De!  If the parents are there a child will usually look to their parents for the way they are suppose to react to someone other than their parent "bossing them around"... My nephew has told me "you're not the boss of me" in the midst of a fit ONCE.  After that one time he now announces to everyone "This is Aunt Gracey's house, and here we have to play by Aunt Gracey's rules".. he is so adorable when he mimics what he thinks sounds like my voice.. hehe 

hahahaha that's funny....

Yeah, the kids that come to my house play by mu rules when its only us.... but once their parents enter the situation, the dynamics change.... and I just find that i don't know what to do to fix it. Am I allowed to override the parent's authority?

I would say Yes.  It is your house, and having to play by the "house rules" is no different whether you are an adult or a child... in most cases.  In most cases, if these children are frequent visitors, maybe the best way to "call them down" for behavior is to simply mention that they "know you aren't suppose to do that".

hmmmm.... yeah.... I'll have to try that

And then you have those parents who don't say anything until you gently remind the kid not to do something, and then they turn around and yell at the kid and completely overdo it..... I feel so bad when that happens... 

To those "yelling" parents I would say "we don't yell in this house.  we will overlook it this time, because you might not have known that rule.. but in the future please remember to use your inside voice"

lol... is it any wonder my husband says I am "awful snarky" at times?

LOL!

Yelling is so unproductive. It just adds fuel to the fire. Don't feel bad Dek. Gracey is right. It's your house and therefore it's your rules.  I do not get offended if someone tells my kids they have done something they should not. On the contrary. I see it as a way of reinforcing my authority and helping them to understand that there are rules in the world that must be respected.

Trust me.... when you try and calm these types of parents down, they get more angry/excited/loud..... it's just nuts

Plus sometimes they think I'm critiqueing their parenting skills.....

These things are so complicated, I just ignore them.... Can't deal with it

Parents and kids... too much to deal with 

It's a jungle that's for sure!

Henry started school this year and I am in contact with more parents and kids than ever before. It's nuts let me tell ya'! 

I use to work daycare, and as I said I love kids.  I delight in their curiousity of the world, and the wonderful things that come into their heads... Granted, I would likely enjoy it less if I was dealing with a kid of my own.. and I have friends that have children that at times drive them bonkers.. But, rules is rules, and to make kids follow rules that adults are "exempt" from is just teaching them that "might is right" (or in this case AGE trumps rules).  Kids learn best by example.

Oh, I remember this ad!

I think sometimes it hard to remember that your kids pick everything up from you.

It's hard to constantly have to watch what you're saying/doing etc 

damn....i missed out on such a great thread that had been around for ages!!! just so i have a say....i thnk kids are great till they learn how to talk.afterwhich they should be kept FARR FARR away from me

I tell you... they're fine until they start school.... then they all get together and scheme against those tall beings that think they rule the world

I actually heard part of that in the voice of Stewie... lol

My cat is looking at me like I am crazy because I just scared his 5th life out of him..

hahahahah You won't be too far off if you heard it in Stewie's voice!

What did you do to the poor cat? 

Because I literally laughed aloud, and he was asleep beside me  

hahahahah

poor cat! if this was my cat, i could have collapsed in a heap next to her and she wouldn't wake up from her beauty sleep.

if he isn't trying to lay on the computer, he is laying on my feet... he is so spoiled!

funny ad... which seems to tie in with all of this:

And I'm a Mom! *rolls eyes* 

(Hey Gracey! I'm not following you around! Lol!)

I love that advert  

(LOL Chimi)

My kids (especially my son) tended to have temper tantrums like that.

One time, in a mall (in the US), he got like that and I picked him up like a sack of potatoes and carried him - wailing and screaming and kicking - out to the car.

I must say it's hard to discipline your kids in the US, though, as there are always people trying to turn you in for the most minimal.

Case in point: my sister... who left the mall behind me saw some man get all scandalized that I would actually *treat my kid* in such a way! (Some people think you should give a child their every whim, I guess.)This man went running to a phone booth. - my sister *thinks* to call the police.

Give me a break. 

beautiful cat Gracey!

hehehe I like that add too! 

Hey Chimi. I'm certain every parent has a similar story. I have done that too. Picked him up, carried him out wailing and screaming and gone home to put him to bed. He needed to sleep so it was time to leave. The day prior to the incident and then after he woke up was pleasant. Isn't it always the way...? One incident feels terrible but it's always such a small part of the whole parenting time spectrum.

All my mum had to do was stare at us and we knew we were in trouble

Here,  here, De!!

My mom has "the look", and if she flashed it at you, that was your hint that you had pushed too far, and your best bet was to simmer down and "straighten up".   One nanosecond of "the look" was enough to scare God in to ya!

yeah.... with the added bonus that she'd turn the look into a full blown fallout once we got home

well actually we all got the "im gonna count to 3 or somebody is gonna get hurt" routine..

which usually ended up in 2, 2 quarters, 2 halfs, 2 3 quarters and so on with diminishing fractions!! 

Oh no!!! Not with my mum......

the stare and then pain!

which usually ended up in 2, 2 quarters, 2 halfs, 2 3 quarters and so on with diminishing fractions!!

I do that as I have never mastered 'the look'. Funny I haven't because I see myself as quite a disciplinarian..  

I have to say, I inherited the 'look' from mother, and it's great if you have it!!!

I use it without the impending pain of course..... never need to go any further!

I'll have to have some lessons. You could do a DIY video for me!

the look is the fatal flaw!!... just proceed straight to the pain.... you should also do the pain at random times... for no reason... that way they don't know what they have done.... or when the next jolt is coming..... keeps them in line &  on their toes....

(this is a joke btw)

Yeah, mate, you need the disclaimer at the end of that one!

well... It wouldn't be the first time I have been miss-understood!

Isn't that a song?

hahahahaha

The look is all one needs.... cos it doesn't just work on kids!
That's the little known secret abt it

well i am making it clear right now... i am not gonna get my kids (when that happens) get away with putting up cute faces...  one wrong move and they are gonna get a whack

 all about discipline me thinks!! 

And let me tell ya'. I reckon it's the hardest parenting thing to get right...

Consistency.

Choose your battles.

Support other power figures eg. husband even if you disagree at the time.. If those little blighters see a chink in the parenting armour they are in for the kill.  

It's a nasty business....

I think one of the worst things to do is to overrule the other parent infront of the kid....

Definite and damning repercussions..

yup!! a real pain once you've lost the upper hand to try to get back any form of similar control.

true true... i guess parents HAVE to always stick together eh?  or you alwasy end up with the "<insert other parent here> said i can <verb> this/that"

It's not only that.... it's a psycological thing as well.... I can't quite explain it

That's what Aunties and Uncles were made for...

"Hey mum you know how you and Dad said I couldn't have <insert dangerous toy here>, well Uncle Mitch bought me one!"

yeah god bless them...

I love being an aunt.... or a much older cousin

It's great! 

It's not only that.... it's a psycological thing as well.... I can't quite explain it

Words escape me too but it does have deep psychology attached to it. It takes a period of time to re-establish authority. 

yeah

regarding the daughter becoming a princess - did you guys hear about a certain french model who as a kid apparantly had her head shaved by her dad every week or so (against her wishes) so that she would have to learn to be interesting rather than just depend on good looks?

huh? So who got their head shaved? The model or her kid?

ok now that's too much - that's still pure torture. 

SO did this model learn to be interesting? 

I like the flower.

aman: dunno! wasnt really focussing on what she was goin on about

Brrr. It would have been cold in winter....

well actually body starts generating warmth to compensate for it!

ooh. aren't our bodies clever? Is that what I need to do then? It's freezin' here in Sydney today!

I'm late in this but just some quick points;

That ad with kids learning from parents was great. Sad, but great.

I think parents should exercise more control of their kids if they are visiting other people. Maybe less if the hosts have kids, but still more. It's like when you are a guest normally. You are on your best behaviour. If kids are going to draw on walls or rip and tear things I think you should both warn the people you're visiting and be extra vigilent with the kids. You might be used to it, but not everyone is.

I also think it's ok to say to visitors that you'd like them to take special care. You might have to make allowances for them, like have a room your comfortable with them playing in, etc. I know you can't have kids visit without the risks, but i guess it depends on the situation - short or long visit, relationship, etc.

And finally I'm sure that my attitude will change when I have kids.

p.s. I generally find parents are on good behaviour and are OK with you asking things of them. You don't expect miracles and they don't let anything really bad happen.